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ITIL :: View topic - Known Error without a Problem?
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Known Error without a Problem?

 
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Oyeeeee
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Joined: May 02, 2008
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Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 6:46 am    Post subject: Known Error without a Problem? Reply with quote

Hello All,

Is it necessary to have a problem record for a known error, or a known error record can exist without an associated problem record.

Please advise.

Thanks.
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UKVIKING
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Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Posts: 3292
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My question back to you is as follows

A known error has to occur from some where.. chicken/egg

surely there is a incident/problem that this came from

that being said

the only known errors that I know of that does not require a problem record

are

Microsoft Windows 3.1 and the 640k memory issue
MS Windows 95
MS WIndows 98
MS WIndows NT 3.52
MS WIndows NT 4
MS WIndows 2000 Workstations
MS Windows 2000 Professional
MS WIndows XP
and the last one

MS Vista

and of course

Internet Explorer
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John Hardesty
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Change Management is POWER & CONTROL. /....evil laughter
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Diarmid
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Location: Newcastle-under-Lyme

PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

... or to put it another way, an error is not a problem if it has no adverse effect, but then it can't really be an error either.

If you think you have found an error with no consequences and you are sure it is an error, then perhaps the problem you need to consider is how to find out what the consequences are. If you can't find any then reclassify the error as not an error.

After all why would you expend effort and resource finding a workaround and a fix for an error that was not costing you anything in the first place?
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Oyeeeee
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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for your replies John and Diarmid,

The reason I was asking this was, say for example the Product Development dept. just released a new version of a software, but due to time constraints, some things were missed out that not all, but some people may require. So they come up with a patch to overcome that issue. It was decided that this issue will be overcome in the next release.

Now I can store this information as a known error so that service desk knows what to do when a user calls in. my question is, Should I still create a Problem Record for this and then associate it to a known error or just create a known error record.

Also, another thing that has me confused is that does every problem has to have a known error record before it is resolved or a permanent fix can be applied to close the problem without it ever becoming a known error?


Please advise.

Thanks.
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UKVIKING
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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

that is not a known error or a problem mgmt area

that is product development

that is software mgmt

a different kettle of fish tobe honest

the release package... what ever it contains is the new version

if the s/w development team does not have a feature/upgrade list this should be their first concern

Software bugs/hidden features etc are not really known errors - unless you act as the repository for the software and the s/w dev/ & support team
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mnsmith
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Location: North West England

PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oyeeeee wrote:
Also, another thing that has me confused is that does every problem has to have a known error record before it is resolved or a permanent fix can be applied to close the problem without it ever becoming a known error?


A problem becomes a known error when you have identified it's root cause and have a workaround. Therefore, how can you resolve a problem without first knowing it's root cause? Even if the problem seems to have been resovled as a side effect of another change, you can't be sure that the problem has been 100% resolved if you don't know what caused it in the first place.

Hope that helps
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asrilrm
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

Interesting discussion, just one question
Is it possible that the proactive problem management comes up with a known error without problem record?

Regards,
Asril
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UKVIKING
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If proactive PM finds a 'problem' / known error, it probably will create a problem record for it then register the known error
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UrgentJensen
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oyeeeee

I agree with Viking: the problem you're describing is a process issue to be handled within either your standard SDLC or a particular project and it's management.

You can have an error without a problem e.g. font colour is wrong. Esthetics don't always get logged. No log => No problem. Go to the pub instead.

UJ
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Diarmid
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

Oyeeeee wrote:
just released a new version of a software, but due to time constraints, some things were missed out that not all, but some people may require.


John is absolutely correct. The product should have been issued with the (unexpected) functional constraints fully documented for the user and a subsequent release would provide additional (but late!) functionality. Your service desk should be able to refer users who enquire to the documentation. It is not a service issue, it is a product issue.
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asrilrm
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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 2:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To follow up

Oyeeeee wrote:
The reason I was asking this was, say for example the Product Development dept. just released a new version of a software, but due to time constraints, some things were missed out that not all, but some people may require. So they come up with a patch to overcome that issue. It was decided that this issue will be overcome in the next release.

Now I can store this information as a known error so that service desk knows what to do when a user calls in. my question is, Should I still create a Problem Record for this and then associate it to a known error or just create a known error record.


Sorry Oyeeeee, but I see that you misunderstood the idea.
Referring your post, I see this as the application lack in features.

A problem should refer to a service that runs improperly or abnormal. This means that the service has to be there to justify normal or abnormal.
Now, how could you detect a problem if the new application runs normally, it only short in promised features?

To me, this is definitely not a problem. It's just a normal upgrade.

One more thing:
Before the application was launched, shouldn't there be an User Acceptance Test and/or Certificate of Final Acceptance (COFA) that confirms the users that this and this and this would be installed in version 1, and so on and so on?

I hope I wrote clear enough

Cheers,
Asril
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mitter
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Joined: Dec 06, 2007
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am confused by the replies in this post
In looking at the ITIL V3 documentation, it states that a Known Error is

- a problem that has a documented Root Cause and Workaround
- Known Errors are managed by Problem Management and
* Known errors may also be identified by Development or Suppliers

In my understanding, issues are are to be released into production from development are to be documented as Known Errors

Are we now saying this is incorrect?
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asrilrm
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mitter,

We are talking about functions or features not included in a release because of time constraint. This would not cause a problem when implemented and in production
What would happen is users complaining that they can't access the function.
This is not a known error, not in my view

You are right about the quoted statements but it should be elaborated more in relation with the circumstance of the case.
Let me give you an example.'
A new application has been developed, tested and ready to implement.
However, the dev. team realized that the application design takes large connection bandwidth. On testing, they can only test with, let's say, 20 conns. They know that if the number of conns increases to 100, it would have a significant impact on the bandwidth, and service will suffer.
The dev. team said that average conns are 60-70 but in peak season would increase to 90-110 (based on the functional requirement).
This, in my opinion, is a potential problem that could be registered as a known error

The above case is just an illustration.

Cheers,
Asril
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