Search
Topics
  Create an account Home  ·  Topics  ·  Downloads  ·  Your Account  ·  Submit News  ·  Top 10  
Modules
· Home
· Content
· FAQ
· Feedback
· Forums
· Search
· Statistics
· Surveys
· Top
· Topics
· Web Links
· Your_Account

Current Membership

Latest: GuyCZLKid
New Today: 3
New Yesterday: 106
Overall: 149878

People Online:
Visitors: 46
Members: 4
Total: 50 .

Languages
Select Interface Language:


Major ITIL Portals
For general information and resources, ITIL and ITSM World is the most well known for both ITIL and ITIL Books. A shorter snapshot approach can be found at ITIL Zone

Related Resources
Service related resources
Service Level Agreement
Outsourcing

Note: ITIL is a registered trademark of OGC. This portal is totally independent and is in no way related to them. See our Feedback Page for more information.


The Itil Community Forum: Forums

ITIL :: View topic - RFC for Add/Remove rows within DB tables
 Forum FAQForum FAQ   SearchSearch   UsergroupsUsergroups   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

RFC for Add/Remove rows within DB tables
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ITIL Forum Index -> Change Management
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
birdman
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: May 06, 2008
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 4:49 am    Post subject: RFC for Add/Remove rows within DB tables Reply with quote

I am new to the forum, and CM, but have read many of the previous discussions. There has been some great information posted and I am looking for some of that advise.
Where I work there are questions concerning what exactly constitutes a Change that would require an RFC. One situation in particular is concerning adding or removing a row or rows within a production database.
Could this be considered a core competency and not required to go through CM? These are very minor, extremely low risk alterations to the database that need to be done on a high frequency basis.
If this needs to go through Change would it be a good candidate for a Standard Change?

Thanks.
Back to top
View user's profile
UKVIKING
Senior Itiler


Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Posts: 3320
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DB work such as add data and remove data is Data Content Management not change management per se

Deleting records from a database should be controlled but not through change management

If the database was being restructured and you were keeping track of that db and db stucture in a CMDB/CI scenario, then making structural changes could be controlled via some CM process
_________________
John Hardesty
ITSM Manager's Certificate (Red Badge)

Change Management is POWER & CONTROL. /....evil laughter
Back to top
View user's profile
franko123
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: Mar 03, 2008
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 6:03 pm    Post subject: Customer records Reply with quote

Hi
I had a similar situation. We have a customer database with all sorts of information e.g what services the customer has, usage etc.
Our CSRs (Customer Service Reps) have certain level of access to the customer data.
However, for some advanced tasks our IT team that customized the database has to get involved and may be doing mass updates to customer data or giving them access where the CSR could not etc.
I understand these are not changes at the database structure level but content only.
Is the only way of looking at what changes occurred through the database logs? I am not familiar with a data content management process for these sort of changes. Content Management to me was more related to web content.

Thanks
Franko
Back to top
View user's profile
UKVIKING
Senior Itiler


Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Posts: 3320
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It would be up to your DB admin and what ever processes and procedures that they set up and manage

It is NOT ITIL. It is DB Admin
_________________
John Hardesty
ITSM Manager's Certificate (Red Badge)

Change Management is POWER & CONTROL. /....evil laughter
Back to top
View user's profile
asrilrm
Senior Itiler


Joined: Oct 07, 2007
Posts: 441
Location: Jakarta, INA

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

Anything related with modifying data is the authorization of the data owner.
Now the question is who is the data owner? The customer of course, even if it's an internal customer.
This means that control is on the owner's hand.
Any change to the data is not within the scope of the Change Management Process

Cheers,
Asril
Back to top
View user's profile
pel
Itiler


Joined: Mar 31, 2008
Posts: 34

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouldn't this depend on how you look at the database instance?

We track a few database instances as CIs because
  1. The DBs are not application specific
  2. The data in the DBs are core business (i.e. _important_)
If someone screw this data up it is sort of 'nice' to know that someone might have screwed up an alteration that might be recoverable without the extra burden of going into full panic mode worrying about data integrity and how that could have happened.

Edit: Also, our customers (in house) use change too.
Back to top
View user's profile
asrilrm
Senior Itiler


Joined: Oct 07, 2007
Posts: 441
Location: Jakarta, INA

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi pel

That's why you need to make periodic backups.
In the case of somebody screw the db, I see it more as data security issue
In theory, bringing db contents as CIs would mean that you will also take the responsibility to watch every activity to the db.
Imagine if hundreds of people accessing the db. Do they have to make RFCs to modify every single data?



Cheers,
Asril
Back to top
View user's profile
UrgentJensen
Senior Itiler


Joined: Feb 23, 2005
Posts: 458
Location: London

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Birdman,

Getting back to the question...

I have redesigned our change request form to allow four different reference types:

Incident
Project
3rd Party
Reference doc

The last of these is to allow staff to quote a procedural document where work is described and is part of their day-to-day jobs, not generated by an incident as such.

Cheers,

UJ
_________________
Did I just say that out loud?

(Beige badge)
Back to top
View user's profile
pel
Itiler


Joined: Mar 31, 2008
Posts: 34

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

asrilrm wrote:
Hi pel

That's why you need to make periodic backups.
That does not help against integrity issues though, does it? Which backup do you want to recover? Which one was the last sane backup? Is there a sane backup?

asrilrm wrote:
In the case of somebody screw the db, I see it more as data security issue
In theory, bringing db contents as CIs would mean that you will also take the responsibility to watch every activity to the db.
Imagine if hundreds of people accessing the db. Do they have to make RFCs to modify every single data?

I am not really well informed of what, exactly, is done to these DBs. It is labeled as maintenance and as such it is required to make RFCs.

Any other use of the DB is through applications and as such not required to go through change. In this sense a DB is not very different from a harddrive. If you use it normaly - no change. If you peek in and start modifing data with a magnetic needle.. (or whatever - hijack the SCSI-bus?) change/sanity check is probably required.
Maybe not the best analogy in the world - but it works for us Smile
Back to top
View user's profile
UKVIKING
Senior Itiler


Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Posts: 3320
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pel,

The issue is whether database deletion of data is a change. It is not. It is merely an administrative action for a DB Admin person to do on a periodic basis

If you track maintainance work through the changemgmt process, that is good. I did and I merely used the change mgmt process and the RFC for maintainance as a scheduled item

Do you require people to create changes for adding or removing files from a shared folder on a server or what they put on the web site

it is not change mgmt per se.. it is content mgmt. There needs to be a content mgmt process developed and written
_________________
John Hardesty
ITSM Manager's Certificate (Red Badge)

Change Management is POWER & CONTROL. /....evil laughter
Back to top
View user's profile
kinger
Itiler


Joined: May 08, 2008
Posts: 39
Location: South West

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Viking,

Surely as per ITIL this is down to the relevant company to decide how this fits into it's structure? In the same way the level of a CI has to be decided, and can be as high or low level as required, the same can apply to Change Management

My personal advice would be to agree with you, this type of change is not worth the effort required, however as something is being 'changed' there is an argument that it could be monitored by Change control.
Back to top
View user's profile MSN Messenger
UKVIKING
Senior Itiler


Joined: Sep 16, 2006
Posts: 3320
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kinger,

Yes it is down to a company and what they put into the CMDB.

If a database is put in the CMDB, what are the CIs

Tables
Fields
Querys
Forms
Reports
programming modules
macros

NOTE: Using MS Access as example

so if a table gets a new field - COuntry abbreviation, then that is a configuratiotn change to the whole table and should be controled through some sort of control process ie change mgmt, db design mgmt

If the country - Outer Camelistan is added to the database as a new record.... should I have to not only raise a change request to add the country and do the data entry in the database

Change Management is NOT nor was it ever designed to manage content

It is designed to manage and control any work that changes /modifies the configuration of an IT h/w or s/w

take it this way....

If my server is grey.. and I want to brighten the dc, I paint each server in a different colour - liek a giant rubik's cude. I made no configuration change - merely a cosmetic work to the other of the box. This is content.

If I pulll all the 10 Mb NIC cards from all servers and replace them with 100 Mb NOC cards, that is a change because I chaneg the configuration of the h/w

A company can decide to manage content through change mgmt but it will merely cause Chaneg mgmt to fail as a process because they are using the wrong tool /process.
_________________
John Hardesty
ITSM Manager's Certificate (Red Badge)

Change Management is POWER & CONTROL. /....evil laughter
Back to top
View user's profile
kinger
Itiler


Joined: May 08, 2008
Posts: 39
Location: South West

PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes I understand, like I said before, it make sense to me, and I agree wth you. However I was just pointing out that if he chooses to manage it in this way he can, but you're right, it's definately not reccommended.
Back to top
View user's profile MSN Messenger
kinger
Itiler


Joined: May 08, 2008
Posts: 39
Location: South West

PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, to add to my previous point, if this was adding or deleting thousands of database records, then I would reccomend this is a change, and have done in the past. According to you viking this would not be the case.

My theory as to why this is the case would be that there is a risk of data corruption, potential downtime, and a lot of the other problems you could associate with a failed change.

It would have a backout plan (restore backup) and steps can be taken to mitigate the risk, to me these are all activities that should be recorded and managed by change management.

Furthermore, giving someone access to your datacentre to paint the servers could also be a change as there is a risk associated, if someone was to fall and knock a server over etc. would there be plans in place as to what would happen?
Back to top
View user's profile MSN Messenger
UrgentJensen
Senior Itiler


Joined: Feb 23, 2005
Posts: 458
Location: London

PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the biggest issue here is matt or gloss? I mean back in the 80's shiney was good but then in the 90's everthing got low key and cool.

So now we're in the 00's what should it be? Wall paper?

UJ
_________________
Did I just say that out loud?

(Beige badge)
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ITIL Forum Index -> Change Management All times are GMT + 10 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

Powered by phpBB 2.0.8 © 2001 phpBB Group
phpBB port v2.1 based on Tom Nitzschner's phpbb2.0.6 upgraded to phpBB 2.0.4 standalone was developed and tested by:
ArtificialIntel, ChatServ, mikem,
sixonetonoffun and Paul Laudanski (aka Zhen-Xjell).

Version 2.1 by Nuke Cops 2003 http://www.nukecops.com

Forums ©

 

Logos/trademarks property of respective owner. Comments property of poster. Rest 2004 Itil Community for Service Management & Foundation Certification. SV
Site source copyright (c)2003, and is Free Software under the GNU / GPL licence. All Rights Are Reserved.